March 2000 - TechToolsList - listserv.classicarcade.com

RE: DATA I/O 29B
by John Robertson 17 Mar '00

17 Mar '00

My reading of the code 10 indicates that it stuffs extra bits in with the data-Start/Stop or some such, I don't have the book at home. So do you not need to convert the raw binary to code 10 before transferring it to the 29B? Or am I missing something? The second version of PL.exe that I have (the one that supports code 16 - Raw Binary) seems to read the eprom just fine, stores the file in raw binary, BUT will not upload to the 29B without getting stalled. The older version of PL (promlink) only goes up to 9600 baud for some strange reason. Unless there is an in-between version that I don't have. My versions are 6.10 (1994), and 3.10 (1991). Does anyone have something else? That supports the 29B? John :-#)# At 07:45 AM 3/14/2000 -0500, mike_ranger(a)dofasco.ca wrote: > [Ranger Mike] > I have never, ever had a problem selecting code 10 and sending down >net rom images, and I've done quite a few! Including 4 bit bi-polars. I do, >however have a problem using the newer, more friendly version of prom link. >It seems to hang on a file transfer, where the old version works fine. > > Mike > > P.S. Going to Chicago in a few weeks, any one know of a tech tool >surplus place to drop by? Looking for a desoldering iron (weller, or pace). > > > > > > > > This incompatibility always bugged me and it's the reason I got a > > Needham's > > PB-10. The Data I/O translation format 10 'Binary' is NOT raw binary it > > can't > > use the binaries that are found on the web. From the Data I/O manual: > > > > "Binary Transfer, Code 10 > > Data transfer in the Binary format consists of a stream of 8-bit data > > words > > preceeded by a byte count and followed by a sum-check. The Binary format > > does not have addresses." > > > > The files you get from the net are just data, no framing information. I've > > never found a way to use these with a 29B. What you CAN try is use the > > PB-10 > > software (free download) to translate the binary to ASCII-HEX then upload > > the converted file using Translation Code 50 (ASCII-HEX SPACE). It's been > > years since I tried this but I seem to remember it was a easy work-around. > > > > > > David Fish "We want...Information. > > INFORMATION > > Melrose, MA USA You won't get it! > > fishd(a)tiac.net By hook or by crook we will" > > dfish(a)bev.etn.com _The Prisoner_ > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in > > the > > message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other > > questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com. John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) http://www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."

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RE: Z80 pods, 2 versions...
by John Robertson 16 Mar '00

16 Mar '00

Well, what would you like me to do? I send out lots of email looking for one unit, and several come back with various assortment of units and pods that they want to sell as a set. They do not like breaking up sets. I have made private trades with folks for these, plus I have sold some off. We have a business here to run, and I need to make money to support it. So I buy them wholesale, then I see that some on eBay went for a fair dollar, I should give them away? Do your own hunting, all that I have bought have been through thorough research on the web. I bought a bunch of damaged probes and am fixing them up, should I not profit from this service? I bought a bunch of Z80 pods in various states, so I fix them and test them. Again, should I not do what my skills enable me to do? This is MY livelihood! John :-#)# At 10:35 AM 3/14/2000 -0600, Keith, Brendan wrote: >So you're buying up more pods and accessories than you need, >then ebaying them to maximize your profit, thus taking them off >the market except to the most well-heeled buyers, whether >hobbyist or not? > >Brendan Keith >brendan.keith(a)wilcom.com > > > > ---------- > > From: John Robertson[SMTP:jrr@flippers.com] > > > > Unfortunatly I have a shop to support, not just a hobby...so I tend to > > eBay > > the things...I have three Z80 pods, five probes, and a 8048 pod > > currently...Last Z80 sold for $183US, and last probe I got $125 (including > > > > postage)...plus I have one 9010A base with RS-232 (tested)... > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in the > message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other > questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com. John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) http://www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."

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"Closed" ->> RE: Z80 pods, 2 versions...
by John Robertson 16 Mar '00

16 Mar '00

OK, I now declare this topic CLOSED. Things will trundle on as before...falling over and picking ourselves up once again... John :-#)# At 03:40 PM 3/15/2000 -0500, FBowen(a)checkfree.com wrote: >I'm happy with you running it, John. > >Although I don't like the prices, I would rather have you put a "FA: on >E-bay" e-mail on this list so I at least have the opportunity to bid on it >if I (looking at my shoes) am well enough heeled. ;-) If others disagree, >then I'll just get your user ID and check what you're selling once in a >while. > > > > > > >John Robertson <jrr(a)flippers.com> on 03/15/2000 01:09:18 PM > >Please respond to TechToolsList(a)flippers.com > >To: TechToolsList(a)flippers.com >cc: > >Subject: RE: Z80 pods, 2 versions... > > >So, I guess, I would like a rough tally of votes on should I continue to >host this or turn it over to someone else? I don't have a problem with that >at all, no offense, etc. So please LMK. > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in the > message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other > questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com. John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) http://www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."

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RE: Z80 pods, 2 versions...
by Keith, Brendan 16 Mar '00

16 Mar '00

Disclaimers: 1. I thought about this overnight in order to compose this reply. 2. I have great respect for John's experience and knowledge. 3. I have received emails on this topic, so am not speaking solely from my own perspective. > From: John Robertson[SMTP:jrr@flippers.com] > > Well, what would you like me to do? I send out lots of email looking for > one unit, and several come back with various assortment of units and pods > that they want to sell as a set. > I don't know. I guess I expected something different from this list. Perhaps I thought it would be similar to the vector and raster list (from which this list sprung, vaguely) where interesting items are offered to members before being sent to ebay (a dirty enough word in itself). > They do not like breaking up sets. I have > made private trades with folks for these, plus I have sold some off. We > have a business here to run, and I need to make money to support it. > Sounds exactly what an amateur (we all know the etymology of that word) would do. Sometimes you have to take in more than you need. > So I buy them wholesale, then I see that some on eBay went for a fair > dollar, I > should give them away? > That's where our paths would start to diverge. > I bought a bunch of damaged probes and am fixing them > up, should I not profit from this service? > Certainly, but why not from some of the very people that joined this list in order to discuss, discover and collect these same tools? Or offer some of the broken ones that you don't want to fix. We know that your time is money. Only you can determine when you are losing profit by working on a pod vs another game that you should get out. I've been attempting to retrieve some of the archives of this list, but off the top of my head, I don't think I've ever seen any of your pods for sale or auction. I also wish that I could retrieve the charter for this list. It's slipped my mind what the full intent was. > I bought a bunch of Z80 pods in > various states, so I fix them and test them. Again, should I not do what > my > skills enable me to do? This is MY livelihood! > Once again, no argument. You, Ray Johnson, G. Stair, E. Spain (marginal), and others are all invaluable professional resources. Clay Cowgill is on the fence and he has his own detractors. Then there are the hobbyists, many with similar and varied skills. There just seems to be two separate factions in each of these lists. Maybe it's never been spoken out loud, but believe me, I know that they exist now. Let me reiterate: You are an exceptional resource. I have been fortunate enough to visit your shop. I have seen the voluminous reference materials. I have discussed with you some of the rare and obsolete platforms that you still support. I have drooled over your drool-worthy racks of PCBs, parts and machines. And I gladly bought the ESR and FBT tester kits. But you're not a hobbyist. I'm not picking up any harsh resentment from others, just a feeling of dismay. It's too bad that this "collection of pods" (5, 15, 50?) isn't spread around the list members. It also means that they are in the hands of the high bidders and, because they were so dearly bought, likely won't come back on the market. Dismaying. That's all I have to say on this. You're a businessman, I don't think your feelings will be hurt. I'm a hobbyist, I'll keep pegging away in my little basement workshop and scrounging for the deals. Your compatriot, nonetheless, Brendan Keith brendan.keith(a)wilcom.com To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in the message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com.

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RE: Should John continue to host this list or not?
by Dale Luck 15 Mar '00

15 Mar '00

I vote for John to continue hosting it. Dale Luck To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in the message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com.

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RE: Z80 pods, 2 versions...
by FBowen＠checkfree.com 15 Mar '00

15 Mar '00

I'm happy with you running it, John. Although I don't like the prices, I would rather have you put a "FA: on E-bay" e-mail on this list so I at least have the opportunity to bid on it if I (looking at my shoes) am well enough heeled. ;-) If others disagree, then I'll just get your user ID and check what you're selling once in a while. John Robertson <jrr(a)flippers.com> on 03/15/2000 01:09:18 PM Please respond to TechToolsList(a)flippers.com To: TechToolsList(a)flippers.com cc: Subject: RE: Z80 pods, 2 versions... So, I guess, I would like a rough tally of votes on should I continue to host this or turn it over to someone else? I don't have a problem with that at all, no offense, etc. So please LMK. To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in the message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com.

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RE: Z80 pods, 2 versions...
by Joe 15 Mar '00

15 Mar '00

At 12:33 PM 3/15/00 -0600, you wrote: >Absolutely continue the list. I never implied anything differently. >We just now have all of our cards on the table. > >I'm sure IF you did feel like offering some of the pods that >you don't have time to repair, they'd be snatched up. > >Want to make money off of ebay buyers? >Try Pokemon cards or Beanie Babies. Or HP calculators or Altair computers or even old 8" floppy disks. The prices that some people will pay is frightening. E-bay abounds with suckers! Joe To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in the message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com.

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Re: Multi-pod (was Re: test equipment)
by Mark Shostak 15 Mar '00

15 Mar '00

>I am awaiting a 6809 pod to arrive (someday) and will dissect it >in time to try and see how easy it would be to modify another pod >to do that. Perhaps a multi-pod is what some bright person here >needs to design! This is how I get into trouble; start with a SMALLER project. (Did I make smaller BIG enough :-) See if you can get the checksum project done. Then work your way up to the big ones. BTW, I'd keep your list where it is and the way it is. You can't win; you can't please everyone all the time. I give you credit for sticking around with all the shit we give you. We complain about the "operators" behavior, but boy I'd hate to have to look in the mirror. -Mark To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in the message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com.

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RE: Z80 pods, 2 versions...
by Keith, Brendan 15 Mar '00

15 Mar '00

Absolutely continue the list. I never implied anything differently. We just now have all of our cards on the table. I'm sure IF you did feel like offering some of the pods that you don't have time to repair, they'd be snatched up. Want to make money off of ebay buyers? Try Pokemon cards or Beanie Babies. No one here will take offence. Brendan Keith brendan.keith(a)wilcom.com > ---------- > From: John Robertson[SMTP:jrr@flippers.com] > > Keith has a number of points here that I think need exploring. > > As a dealer, should I be running this list? I have wondered about the > conflict of interest that is possible here, > > So, I guess, I would like a rough tally of votes on should I continue to > host this or turn it over to someone else? I don't have a problem with > that > at all, no offense, etc. So please LMK. (I think there is at least one > other technical mail list floating around, saw a reference to one in a > search on google.) > To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in the message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com.

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Re: test equipment
by Thomas43＠aol.com 15 Mar '00

15 Mar '00

In a message dated 3/2/00 11:25:29 AM, KKlopp(a)EROLS.COM writes: << How much effort would it be to build a 6809 pod from scratch? Documentation for the Fluke 90 also mentioned a 6809 version but I've never seen one. Kev >> Basically nothing. It's just a board with a bunch of inputs from the cat box, the lines cross all over the place, and then come out the other side in a different configuration. I think there is one small cap and one 2n2904 transistor on the board. It looks like a $2 board (that they sold for several hundred). I may have the schematics for all of these pods that I can scan and post. Scott To UNSUBSCRIBE from techtoolslist, send a message with "UNSUBSCRIBE" in the message body to: techtoolslist-request(a)flippers.com. Please direct other questions, comments, or problems to jrr(a)flippers.com.

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