Re: [Techtoolslist] Designing a 9010 replacement LED display?

9 Feb 2024

      On 2022/12/05 3:10 p.m., Jose Luiz Martins wrote:
...
I'll send one 9010 that I have as a spare to him.
This way, He can make the appropriate measurements and design a board 
that fits on a regular 9010.
JL
Hi Jose,

Did your friend ever get the 9010 displays ready for sale?

Thanks!

John :-#)#
...
On Mon, Dec 5, 2022 at 6:24 PM John Robertson via Techtoolslist 
<techtoolslist@flippers.com> wrote:
On 2022/12/05 12:54 p.m., Jose Luiz Martins wrote:
    > He sent me this picture.
That looks pretty good. Those modules are pretty reasonably priced
    too.
    Might be a good solution, plus one can buy a spare or two tubes
    for the
    future if they ever fail...
Does your friend say if he knows if this will fit in a regular
    9010/9005
    box? Of course he doesn't have one of the units, does he, so not
    sure if
    he can answer that...
Thanks!
John :-#)#
>
    > Em seg., 5 de dez. de 2022 17:48, Jose Luiz Martins
    > <joseluizmartins@gmail.com> escreveu:
    >
    >     He told-me, he is now working in a new version for regular LCD
    >     modules.
    >
    >     I'll call him later to ask for the update.
    >
    >
    >     JL
    >
    >     Em seg., 5 de dez. de 2022 17:34, John Robertson via
    Techtoolslist
    >     <techtoolslist@flippers.com> escreveu:
    >
    >         On 2022/12/05 11:58 a.m., Jose Luiz Martins wrote:
    >         > I know him, he is a very nice guy.
    >         >
    >         > I have one of this kits, it it's very well made. If
    you guys
    >         have
    >         > interesting, I can talk to him to manage a discount
    for this
    >         group.
    >         >
    >         >
    >         > JL
    >
    >         Thanks for the info.
    >
    >         Isn't the problem that our friend in Brazil used the
    Itron fg326
    >         display? Those are kinda hard to come by. So failing
    turning up a
    >         display, one is looking at a replacement - probably LED.
    >
    >         John :-#)#
    >
    >         >
    >         > Em seg., 5 de dez. de 2022 16:53, Tony Jones
    >         <tony@tonyjones.com> escreveu:
    >         >
    >         >> I assume you guys saw this:
    >         >>
    >         >>
    >
    https://forums.arcade-museum.com/threads/the-fluke-9010a-club.97717/post-443...
    >         >>
    >         >> On Mon, Dec 5, 2022 at 11:08 AM Brad Gass via
    Techtoolslist <
    >         >> techtoolslist@flippers.com> wrote:
    >         >>
    >         >>> I guess I hadn't looked at dot matrix displays
    because of
    >         the cost, but
    >         >>> they certainly seem feasible from a technical
    standpoint.
    >         From UT
    >         >> Source,
    >         >>> the 3416 size red displays are still a lot more than an
    >         LCD, but at
    >         >> ~$21.14
    >         >>> each, are certainly more reasonable than from Newark.
    >         >>>
    >         >>> Although I wouldn't fuss over a red versus green display
    >         if red were
    >         >> lower
    >         >>> cost, I did put in an inquiry on the DLG3416 (green)
    Osram
    >         version of
    >         >> that
    >         >>> display, which would more closely match the Fluke's
    look.
    >         Awaiting a
    >         >> quote.
    >         >>> So, the question is really - retrofit the existing board
    >         with a mezzanine
    >         >>> type board (if feasible), or a full-on redesign of the
    >         board?  Anyone
    >         >> know
    >         >>> if there is enough 5V rail current headroom to
    support up
    >         to another 1A
    >         >> of
    >         >>> draw (worst case)?  I suspect the safest bet would be to
    >         create a new 5V
    >         >>> supply for the character modules from the +55V rail used
    >         to provide power
    >         >>> to the VFD.
    >         >>>
    >         >>> Thanks,
    >         >>>
    >         >>> --Brad
    >         >>>
    >         >>> ----- Original Message -----
    >         >>> From: "Technical Tools Mail List"
    <techtoolslist@flippers.com>
    >         >>> To: "Technical Tools Mail List"
    <techtoolslist@flippers.com>
    >         >>> Cc: "John Robertson" <jrr@flippers.com>
    >         >>> Sent: Sunday, December 4, 2022 12:51:39 AM
    >         >>> Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] Designing a 9010
    replacement
    >         LED display?
    >         >>>
    >         >>> On 2022/12/01 8:37 p.m., Brad Gass wrote:
    >         >>>> There doesn't appear to be small-pitch alphanumeric LED
    >         displays
    >         >>>> available (at least that I could find) that would work
    >         here without
    >         >>>> being much too large for the space. There are a couple
    >         Noritake Itron
    >         >>>> graphic VFD's that might work, but those are going
    to be
    >         expensive,
    >         >>>> and don't appear readily available either.
    >         >>>>
    >         >>>> I think what might be a workable approach would be
    to use
    >         a 40x1
    >         >>>> character LCD module with a reasonably bright
    backlight.
    >         There seem to
    >         >>>> be a couple models pretty readily available on the
    >         surplus market that
    >         >>>> may work out. It's not perfect, and the surplus
    displays
    >         may or may
    >         >>>> not support "inverted" displays (light text on black
    >         background), but
    >         >>>> anything is a lot better than nothing if you have a bum
    >         display! But
    >         >>>> no matter what the approach, additional design effort
    >         would be needed
    >         >>>> to capture the segment drive data for each character,
    >         decode it into
    >         >>>> character data for the LCD, then output it to the
    LCD module.
    >         >>>>
    >         >>>> In looking at pictures of the display PCB, this may be
    >         retrofit-able
    >         >>>> on the existing board with a bit of clever
    craftsmanship.
    >         >From the
    >         >>>> schematic, abandon U3 through U10 in place, pick off
    >         character clock
    >         >>>> (U6 pin 9) and data (U6 pin 7) from the head of the
    >         character drive
    >         >>>> shift register chain, and get segment clock (U13 pin or
    >         U14 pin 3) and
    >         >>>> data (U13 pin 2 *and* U14 pin 2) from the segment
    drive shift
    >         >>>> registers. Decode the captured data into ASCII (or
    >         custom) characters,
    >         >>>> then send them out to the LCD, updating only the LCD
    >         character
    >         >>>> positions that change between VFD "refresh cycles" to
    >         keep the LCD
    >         >>>> character flicker to a minimum.
    >         >>>> Does anyone know the full "character map" of the
    9010? As
    >         near as I
    >         >>>> can recall, it's all standard ASCII characters but I
    >         honestly don't
    >         >>>> remember if there was any oddball symbols that
    might need
    >         to be mapped
    >         >>>> to custom characters on the LCD. I've been busy with
    >         other life issues
    >         >>>> and away from the bench for much too long now, but
    >         wouldn't mind
    >         >>>> working at this a bit if there were others
    interested in
    >         helping out.
    >         >>>>
    >         >>>> --Brad
    >         >>> I did find what appears to be a suitable LED display
    >         module, that will
    >         >>> fit in the space, but we need 8 of them and they cost
    >         around $36US each:
    >         >>>
    >         >>>
    >         >>>
    >         >>
    >
    https://www.newark.com/broadcom/hdlo-3416/led-alphanumeric-display-dot-matri...
    >         >>> 8 of them is just over 6.5 inches, and the original
    space
    >         is around 6.75
    >         >>> inches. Height is 0.274" or close enough to the
    original 0.3"
    >         >>> fluorescent digit.
    >         >>>
    >         >>> They are ASCII coded, and even have 8 user defined
    >         characters available.
    >         >>>
    >         >>> Not so cheap, but with a bit of logic glue possibly a
    >         worthwhile fix
    >         >>> considering the 9010 is worthless without a display...
    >         >>>
    >         >>> John :-#)#
    >         >>>
    >         >>>> ----- Original Message -----
    >         >>>> From: "Technical Tools Mail List"
    >         <techtoolslist@flippers.com>
    >         >>>> To: "Technical Tools Mail List"
    <techtoolslist@flippers.com>
    >         >>>> Cc: "John Robertson" <jrr@flippers.com>
    >         >>>> Sent: Thursday, December 1, 2022 7:47:51 PM
    >         >>>> Subject: [Techtoolslist] Designing a 9010
    replacement LED
    >         display?
    >         >>>>
    >         >>>> I was looking at my 9005 and grumbling because the tube
    >         is missing,
    >         >> then
    >         >>>> I pulled out the 9010a service manual and you know, it
    >         looks like it
    >         >>>> would be a pretty easy fix to replace the tube with
    32 digit
    >         >>>> alpha-numeric LEDs of the correct size on a small
    PCB and
    >         all that
    >         >> would
    >         >>>> be needed is to replace the UDN6118 fluorescent drivers
    >         with suitable
    >         >>>> LED drivers and find a place to grab 5V and ground and
    >         then mount the
    >         >>>> new display to the board...
    >         >>>>
    >         >>>> Maybe it would work?
    >         >>>>
    >         >>>> Anyone interested in poking at the KiCAD layout? I have
    >         no free time,
    >         >>>> but I know there are folks out there looking for a
    >         solution to bad or
    >         >>>> weak tubes...
    >         >>>>
    >         >>>> Here is the page:
    >         >>>>
    >         >>
    >
    ftp://ftp.flippers.com/TTL/Test_Equipment/Fluke/9010%20Series/9010_Fixture%20PDFs/9010A_Display_Schematic.pdf
    >         >>>> <
    >         >>
    >
    ftp://ftp.flippers.com/TTL/Test_Equipment/Fluke/9010%20Series/9010_Fixture%20PDFs/9010A_Display_Schematic.pdf
    >         >>>>
    >         >>>> John :-#)#
    >         >>>>
    >
-- 
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7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
Call (604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
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