Sunday Projects II: Replacing a DS1216B RealTimeClock?
Heya.... It has been a busy day for me... one more posting before Game of Thrones comes on..... I have a DS1216B 'SmartWatch' by Dallas/Maxim in my Fluke 900.... These are little real-time-clock IC's with embedded in double height potted 28-DIP that sits under your RAM. In this case, the battery is in the potted bottom part of the socket and is now officially dead, rendering the IC useless for keeping time. Here is a pic of one for reference.. http://sg.rs-online.com/largeimages/R0133242-06.jpg So, I have found a few options and Im curious if any of you have gone down this path before on this device or on others? (SG motherboards have a similar chip, Bally gambling machines, Apple IIE/C, etc)... Option #1: Buy an NOS DS1216B from Ebay... they are pretty cheap.... $15, but they have date codes from the late 80's.... likelihood of the battery being solid.... Poor. Option #2: Look at this cool thing that the Apple collectors made.. https://www.ultimateapple2.com/catalogzen154/index.php?main_page=product_inf... . More expensive $45, but has a small replaceable battery Option #3: Hack into mine and try and put a larger (and longer life 3.6V Lithium battery on it). Cheap, but hacky.... Mounting a battery clip to my PCB with epoxy or double sided tape sounds problematic (maybe) Option #4: anyone else know of more options? Right now Im leaning towards #2 or #3, It doesn't matter if I destroy mine, it is already dead and I have it off the device motherboard now too. #3 would be good if I could secure the battery decently on my motherboard (it will be hanging upside down too, so the double sided tape definitely is not a good idea. _______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
If I recall correctly...the DS SmartWatch chips were shipped in a standby mode until the first READ or some other function. Just maybe, NOS parts still have juice. Hope so because I too have some stock from the '80's! BTW if the device is powered, the battery is not spent. On 5/15/2016 10:14 PM, Jess Askey wrote:
Heya.... It has been a busy day for me... one more posting before Game of Thrones comes on.....
I have a DS1216B 'SmartWatch' by Dallas/Maxim in my Fluke 900.... These are little real-time-clock IC's with embedded in double height potted 28-DIP that sits under your RAM. In this case, the battery is in the potted bottom part of the socket and is now officially dead, rendering the IC useless for keeping time.
_______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
That was my understanding as well based on a conversation with a Dallas/Maxim FAE I used to know. I had exactly the same question when replacing the DS1244 RTC/SRAM module on some old Galaxy dartboards - having received almost 5 year old parts. He claimed that the internal battery is disconnected on all RTC parts until first power up (by what mechanism I don't know, he didn't say). FWIW. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Riddle (Technical Dept.)" <enginr@windstream.net> To: "Technical Tools Mail List" <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Sent: Monday, May 16, 2016 9:08:23 AM Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] Sunday Projects II: Replacing a DS1216B RealTimeClock? If I recall correctly...the DS SmartWatch chips were shipped in a standby mode until the first READ or some other function. Just maybe, NOS parts still have juice. Hope so because I too have some stock from the '80's! BTW if the device is powered, the battery is not spent. On 5/15/2016 10:14 PM, Jess Askey wrote:
Heya.... It has been a busy day for me... one more posting before Game of Thrones comes on.....
I have a DS1216B 'SmartWatch' by Dallas/Maxim in my Fluke 900.... These are little real-time-clock IC's with embedded in double height potted 28-DIP that sits under your RAM. In this case, the battery is in the potted bottom part of the socket and is now officially dead, rendering the IC useless for keeping time.
_______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/ _______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Brad Gass <bradg@digitalplains.net> wrote:
That was my understanding as well based on a conversation with a Dallas/Maxim FAE I used to know.
From: "Dave Riddle (Technical Dept.)" <enginr@windstream.net> If I recall correctly...the DS SmartWatch chips were shipped in a standby mode until the first READ or some other function.
Hi. Thanks for the above. I assume the standby mode also applies also to the DS1287? I'm curious if anyone has replaced the one on their 9100? On the FT series it's on the SCSI/IEEE488 card (which is different from the 9100A card). When I got my 9105FT it was complaining that I needed to replace the RTC battery. I was concerned about the longevity of a used DS1287 and many of the Chinese sellers of new 1287A seemed to be conflating with the 12887/12887A. I bought a DS12887A aware of the Maxim app note about possible incompatibility. I could swear it fixed the problem but when I recently I powered it up I got a different message that the RTC could not be initialized. This thread is timely as my 9100FT has just started producing the same initial message about needing to replace the RTC battery. I'm curious if anyone has been through this before? Thanks. Tony _______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
And one quick follow up on this before I send pics of my replacement... the internals of the DS1216B is simply the CHIP PCB, two button batteries and the IC onboard is just a straight DS1215 labelled as a DS1216. The datasheet the DS1215 along with the connection details are here.... http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/58438/DALLAS/DS1215.html . I will basically just add a 32.768Mhz crystal and the CR2032 battery along with my DIP DS1216 and it should be solid with a replaceable battery then. -----Original Message----- From: Techtoolslist [mailto:techtoolslist-bounces@flippers.com] On Behalf Of Brad Gass Sent: Monday, May 16, 2016 8:28 AM To: enginr@windstream.net; Technical Tools Mail List <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] Sunday Projects II: Replacing a DS1216B RealTimeClock? That was my understanding as well based on a conversation with a Dallas/Maxim FAE I used to know. I had exactly the same question when replacing the DS1244 RTC/SRAM module on some old Galaxy dartboards - having received almost 5 year old parts. He claimed that the internal battery is disconnected on all RTC parts until first power up (by what mechanism I don't know, he didn't say). FWIW. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Riddle (Technical Dept.)" <enginr@windstream.net> To: "Technical Tools Mail List" <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Sent: Monday, May 16, 2016 9:08:23 AM Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] Sunday Projects II: Replacing a DS1216B RealTimeClock? If I recall correctly...the DS SmartWatch chips were shipped in a standby mode until the first READ or some other function. Just maybe, NOS parts still have juice. Hope so because I too have some stock from the '80's! BTW if the device is powered, the battery is not spent. On 5/15/2016 10:14 PM, Jess Askey wrote:
Heya.... It has been a busy day for me... one more posting before Game of Thrones comes on.....
I have a DS1216B 'SmartWatch' by Dallas/Maxim in my Fluke 900.... These are little real-time-clock IC's with embedded in double height potted 28-DIP that sits under your RAM. In this case, the battery is in the potted bottom part of the socket and is now officially dead, rendering the IC useless for keeping time.
_______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/ _______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/ _______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
Why not make 5 or 6 mail ready and offer them? On 5/17/2016 6:28 PM, Jess Askey wrote:
And one quick follow up on this before I send pics of my replacement... the internals of the DS1216B is simply the CHIP PCB, two button batteries and the IC onboard is just a straight DS1215 labelled as a DS1216. The datasheet the DS1215 along with the connection details are here.... http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/58438/DALLAS/DS1215.html . I will basically just add a 32.768Mhz crystal and the CR2032 battery along with my DIP DS1216 and it should be solid with a replaceable battery then.
_______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
I'm taking apart my existing DS1216B and extraction the parts to mount onto my Fluke 900 because it has a little mod grid built into the motherboard. I think that for most people, the NOS (30 year old) parts from Ebay, are probably acceptable, or purchasing the Apple item I linked would probably be the best option. That Apple product is pretty much an exact copy with updated parts and a replaceable battery. Probably the best option if you can stomach the 45$. Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: "Dave Riddle (Technical Dept.)" <enginr@windstream.net> Date: 5/17/16 5:24 PM (GMT-07:00) To: Technical Tools Mail List <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] Sunday Projects II: Replacing a DS1216B RealTimeClock? Why not make 5 or 6 mail ready and offer them? On 5/17/2016 6:28 PM, Jess Askey wrote:
And one quick follow up on this before I send pics of my replacement... the internals of the DS1216B is simply the CHIP PCB, two button batteries and the IC onboard is just a straight DS1215 labelled as a DS1216. The datasheet the DS1215 along with the connection details are here.... http://www.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/pdf/58438/DALLAS/DS1215.html . I will basically just add a 32.768Mhz crystal and the CR2032 battery along with my DIP DS1216 and it should be solid with a replaceable battery then.
_______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/ _______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
Yes, you are right about the 'standby' mode. I ordered a replacement one from Ebay since it was only $16. I will be doing the mod below so that I can also use a stock replacement, but I have a feeling that my mod will be done before the DS2016B arrives from China... two weeks. I also dug into my 1216B chip too.. pictures here - http://www.askey.org/fluke_900_rtc/ I didn't get a pic before I started destroying it... but here it is with the 6264 RAM off and the socket popped off the top, AND the DS1216 removed.... it is a DIP but the pins are bent out and it is surface mounted... it came off pretty easily. http://www.askey.org/fluke_900_rtc/20160515_231039.jpg All of the pins go straight through to the 6264 with the exception of 3... Pin 20 - /CE - This allows the DS1216 to talk to the CPU 'in place of the RAM' when appropriate by not enabling the RAM when it wants to put data on the D0 bit (the RTC communicates via a single bit) Pin 26 - CE2 - This is joined to Pin 28 and functions the same, on a 6264, this is set to VCC, so it doesn't effect anything since it is essentially HIGH all the time. Pin 28 - Vcc - This is the Vcc of the RAM.... the DS1216 either passes the PCB Vcc through to the RAM, or if the Vcc falls below Vbb (Battery), then it puts the Vbb voltage on here, the RTC powers the RAM making it non-volitile as a feature. It of course, also provides the 'phantom' real time clock function too In this unit, Fluke was nice enough to give a modification grid.... So, I added a CR2032 battery holder and the DS1216 off the PCB.... http://www.askey.org/fluke_900_rtc/20160515_231626.jpg You can see in the pic.. Blue area - The original 6264 SRAM sitting in a regular socket Orange area - The new battery socket and the DS1216 in a socket. I will need to wire this up and pull the 3 pins of the 6264 SRAM out of the PCB socket and over to the DS1216, then wire a few other lines over to the DS1216, and Voila, I *think* it will work. I'll report back after I get some time later this week to work on it again. The DS2016 datasheet is readily available on the interwebs and has some interesting information about the 'phantom' access methods for the RTC. -----Original Message----- From: Techtoolslist [mailto:techtoolslist-bounces@flippers.com] On Behalf Of Dave Riddle (Technical Dept.) Sent: Monday, May 16, 2016 8:08 AM To: Technical Tools Mail List <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] Sunday Projects II: Replacing a DS1216B RealTimeClock? If I recall correctly...the DS SmartWatch chips were shipped in a standby mode until the first READ or some other function. Just maybe, NOS parts still have juice. Hope so because I too have some stock from the '80's! BTW if the device is powered, the battery is not spent. On 5/15/2016 10:14 PM, Jess Askey wrote:
Heya.... It has been a busy day for me... one more posting before Game of Thrones comes on.....
I have a DS1216B 'SmartWatch' by Dallas/Maxim in my Fluke 900.... These are little real-time-clock IC's with embedded in double height potted 28-DIP that sits under your RAM. In this case, the battery is in the potted bottom part of the socket and is now officially dead, rendering the IC useless for keeping time.
_______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/ _______________________________________________ Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com https://pairlist7.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
participants (4)
-
Brad Gass -
Dave Riddle (Technical Dept.) -
Jess Askey -
Tony Jones