Re: [Techtoolslist] WANTED : in-circuit IC tester
Has anyone had good luck with the HP10529 ? I seem to get a lot of false ic failures during tests. Have you seen the HP ever show a failed IC test good? Justin Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID Fabrizio Vasile <fabrizio.vasile@gmail.com> wrote:
Yes, ABI Boardmaster 4000 in another tool on my list but nowadays it's pretty rare and still quite expensive.Besides it seems it's quite fragile in some parts.Anyway it's a great piece of equipment but , like other in-circuit tester, has its pro and con.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Coates" <mike@the-coates.com> To: "Technical Tools Mail List" <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 7:16 PM Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] WANTED : in-circuit IC tester
I have an ABI 4000, and find that if it tells you an IC is good, then it is, if it tells you it's bad, then double check it, because it's wrong 60% of the time!
however, for repairing things for which schematics are not available, or it has a hidden PCB (where there's 2 or 3 pcb's for instance, that plug into each other) it still proves useful.
Once I have set it up, I tend to check everything in the area of concern, and put white stickers on anything dodgy - then use the fluke and the probe to decide if they really have failed!
On 30/07/2013 17:54, Matthew Rossiter wrote:
Has anyone here ever used the ICT-101 with much success? I had one for a while and the results were so sketchy that I eventually sold it back on ebay. I saw a lot of good IC's come up as FAIL. Once you lose a certain amount of trust with a tester, it's really not much use.
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Yes, using the HP 10529A I had several times good IC showed as bad (especially counters, flip-flop) but, most terrible thing, a couple of times I had also bad IC showed as good! ----- Original Message ----- From: "JJ" <rugd2go@comcast.net> To: "Technical Tools Mail List" <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:59 PM Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] WANTED : in-circuit IC tester
Has anyone had good luck with the HP10529 ? I seem to get a lot of false ic failures during tests. Have you seen the HP ever show a failed IC test good?
Justin
Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID
Fabrizio Vasile <fabrizio.vasile@gmail.com> wrote:
Yes, ABI Boardmaster 4000 in another tool on my list but nowadays it's pretty rare and still quite expensive.Besides it seems it's quite fragile in some parts.Anyway it's a great piece of equipment but , like other in-circuit tester, has its pro and con.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Coates" <mike@the-coates.com> To: "Technical Tools Mail List" <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 7:16 PM Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] WANTED : in-circuit IC tester
I have an ABI 4000, and find that if it tells you an IC is good, then it is, if it tells you it's bad, then double check it, because it's wrong 60% of the time!
however, for repairing things for which schematics are not available, or it has a hidden PCB (where there's 2 or 3 pcb's for instance, that plug into each other) it still proves useful.
Once I have set it up, I tend to check everything in the area of concern, and put white stickers on anything dodgy - then use the fluke and the probe to decide if they really have failed!
On 30/07/2013 17:54, Matthew Rossiter wrote:
Has anyone here ever used the ICT-101 with much success? I had one for a while and the results were so sketchy that I eventually sold it back on ebay. I saw a lot of good IC's come up as FAIL. Once you lose a certain amount of trust with a tester, it's really not much use.
Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
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As i've mentioned before, i think that you believe there is equipment out there that can give you a 100% accurate pass/go test on IC's. It doesn't exist. Regarding the 10529A: If an input node is tied to ground/5v because of an internal short, then the comparison with a known-good IC will not show up any fault in the 10529. Its rare to find, but does happen. The comparator is just that, it presents the same inputs to a known-good ic that the ic under test has. The outputs are compared, any differences show up. Failure modes of IC's can be varied, and a comparison method cannot find every single failure type in the same way that node stimulation can't either. The 10529A is by far, the best all-round tool you can own, laborious though it is to use the ZIF socket to swap IC's and change pin assignments. You have to remember to power-cycle the unit-under-test for counters and flip-flops so that you get the same power-on states, otherwise your comparisons will be wrong. I'm talking from 13 years experience of arcade pcb repairing here, i also own an ABI Boardmaster 4000, amongst other equipment for in-circuit testing. If you have written off the 10529A as no good then you stand no chance using any of the other pieces of equipment to good effect. You need to understand failures and how they can manifest themselves first. The holy grail of a pass/go system you seek is not within reach. Andrew Welburn http://www.andys-arcade.com On 30/07/2013 21:07, Fabrizio Vasile wrote:
Yes, using the HP 10529A I had several times good IC showed as bad (especially counters, flip-flop) but, most terrible thing, a couple of times I had also bad IC showed as good! ----- Original Message ----- From: "JJ" <rugd2go@comcast.net> To: "Technical Tools Mail List" <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:59 PM Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] WANTED : in-circuit IC tester
Has anyone had good luck with the HP10529 ? I seem to get a lot of false ic failures during tests. Have you seen the HP ever show a failed IC test good?
Justin
Techtoolslist mailing list Techtoolslist@flippers.com http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/techtoolslist FTP site is: ftp://ttl.arcadetech.org/TTL/Test_Equipment Archive site: http://seven.pairlist.net/pipermail/techtoolslist/
Hi Andrew.No, I know very well there is no equipment which can test TTL in-circuit absolutely . But , I meant, something that can point you in the right direction testing in-circuit logic functions and not comparing like the HP 10529A I think I'll get a B&K Precision 560 IC tester after trying to find an ABI Boardmaster 4000 at a reasonable price with no success. Then, if these in-circuit tester existe then they mean they are useful in some way, don't you think?I presume you didn't spend a lot of money into the ABI Boardmaster 4000 to keep it as an ornament..:) 2013/7/31 Andrew Welburn <andy@andysarcade.net>
As i've mentioned before, i think that you believe there is equipment out there that can give you a 100% accurate pass/go test on IC's. It doesn't exist.
Regarding the 10529A:
If an input node is tied to ground/5v because of an internal short, then the comparison with a known-good IC will not show up any fault in the 10529. Its rare to find, but does happen.
The comparator is just that, it presents the same inputs to a known-good ic that the ic under test has. The outputs are compared, any differences show up. Failure modes of IC's can be varied, and a comparison method cannot find every single failure type in the same way that node stimulation can't either.
The 10529A is by far, the best all-round tool you can own, laborious though it is to use the ZIF socket to swap IC's and change pin assignments. You have to remember to power-cycle the unit-under-test for counters and flip-flops so that you get the same power-on states, otherwise your comparisons will be wrong.
I'm talking from 13 years experience of arcade pcb repairing here, i also own an ABI Boardmaster 4000, amongst other equipment for in-circuit testing.
If you have written off the 10529A as no good then you stand no chance using any of the other pieces of equipment to good effect. You need to understand failures and how they can manifest themselves first.
The holy grail of a pass/go system you seek is not within reach.
Andrew Welburn http://www.andys-arcade.com
On 30/07/2013 21:07, Fabrizio Vasile wrote:
Yes, using the HP 10529A I had several times good IC showed as bad (especially counters, flip-flop) but, most terrible thing, a couple of times I had also bad IC showed as good! ----- Original Message ----- From: "JJ" <rugd2go@comcast.net> To: "Technical Tools Mail List" <techtoolslist@flippers.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 30, 2013 9:59 PM Subject: Re: [Techtoolslist] WANTED : in-circuit IC tester
Has anyone had good luck with the HP10529 ? I seem to get a lot of
false ic failures during tests. Have you seen the HP ever show a failed IC test good?
Justin
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participants (3)
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Andrew Welburn -
Fabrizio Vasile -
JJ