On the subject of KK units.... I have a KK ROM tester, no documentation, it just has 2 rows of machine pin sockets on the top and inputs for the sig analysis connections. I always assumed is just calculates sigs on the ROMs, but I never really knew, or used it for that matter. Anyone know about this one? I also picked up a Bugtrap DRAM tester on Fleabay for $10, works great. Does everything down to 4116s... It is configurable for the timing and everything. Works great for me, as my current eprom burner/chip tester doesn't handle triple power supply parts. If you get a chance to grab one, I would definitely go for it. I think it's the Bugtrap model 8000. James -----Original Message----- From: Kev [mailto:KKlopp@EROLS.COM] Sent: Friday, January 14, 2000 3:20 PM To: TechToolsList@flippers.com Subject: Re: Signature Analyzers
For some dumb reason I have several of them, I have the HP 5004 and 5006, a bug trap sig analyzer and a Kurz Kasch model. All are basically about the same, at least as much as I use them. Honestly, I find I seldom use signature analysis. About the only time it really comes in handy is working on vector mathboxes. But it's nice to have it for well documented projects, like the cinematronics boards.
James
Gosh I thought I was the only "dummy" with 3 sig analyzers in the house. I've got the Bugtrap (My personal favorite) Kurz Kash and the Cat Box. If anyone is interested in the KK box I'll sell it or trade it. I've also go the KK eprom copier & several modules if anyone has any need for that (read vintage equipment). My use of a SA? Well I was fighting enough with Bally pinball boards MPU 17 & 35 that I went thru & did some SA. I started to do Pac-Man but the buffering circuits complicates SA implimentation. I have used the SA on Pac-Man to catch funky 74ls161's in the timing section. This is a rare case where a using an O-scope the way I do (probe, see if the signal is full range & looks "normal") would not have found the faulty 74ls161, since the outputs were toggling & appeared to work, they just were not correct. I have unsuccefully SA a Battlezone Math box before. The SA is an okay tool, it will be more powerful the more people document & share Signatures. I'd take an O-scope of a SA any day but the SA is cheaper and depending on your focus not a bad tool. Kev mowerman@erols.com http://www.erols.com/mowerman
On the subject of KK units.... I have a KK ROM tester, no documentation, it just has 2 rows of machine pin sockets on the top and inputs for the sig analysis connections. I always assumed is just calculates sigs on the ROMs, but I never really knew, or used it for that matter. Anyone know about this one?
From what I've seen in documentation I've picked up this unit calculates signatures for each pin. You must probe & record each pin of the data lines to check a ROM. No body does that anymore do they?
I also picked up a Bugtrap DRAM tester on Fleabay for $10, works great. Does everything down to 4116s... It is configurable for the timing and everything. Works great for me, as my current eprom burner/chip tester doesn't handle triple power supply parts. If you get a chance to grab one, I would definitely go for it. I think it's the Bugtrap model 8000.
Wow, that is a buy. Still thinking about the Fluke 9010 & dynamic in circuit testing.....
Kev mowerman@erols.com http://www.erols.com/mowerman
While wandering around the net last night I stumbled accross this: http://elexp.com/tst_ta32.htm Could this be a modern day equivalent to the Fluke 9010? Opinions? Course you'd have to mortgage the Quantum to buy one... :-( Noel
I have all the docs on the dram tester, it even came in the original box with all the original packaging. It's rather complex, I doubt doing a repro would be economically feasible. I didn't even know they existed until I bought this one. Will definitely keep my eyes open for more. Sounds like something good to look for at this years' Dayton Hamfest :) Here's a quick snapshot of the unit, I will get a higher quality pic if anyone wants it: http://www.erinet.com/jamesm/temp/bugtrap8000.jpg James John Robertson wrote:
James, did the Bug Trap come with a manual or schematic? Would it be possible to reproduce this device? I could really use one of these in the shop and would be willing to build one if not to complex... Might trade...
I have docs on the KK Eprom programmer, the burner itself, and a bunch of the cards. This device would let you cross program devices (2532 <->2732) or copy most eproms from the 70's up to the 2764 series. I think it would even allow the copying of the 1701(2?) Eprom.
John :-#)#
At 12:52 PM 1/14/2000 -0500, you wrote:
On the subject of KK units.... I have a KK ROM tester, no documentation, it just has 2 rows of machine pin sockets on the top and inputs for the sig analysis connections. I always assumed is just calculates sigs on the ROMs, but I never really knew, or used it for that matter. Anyone know about this one?
I also picked up a Bugtrap DRAM tester on Fleabay for $10, works great. Does everything down to 4116s... It is configurable for the timing and everything. Works great for me, as my current eprom burner/chip tester doesn't handle triple power supply parts. If you get a chance to grab one, I would definitely go for it. I think it's the Bugtrap model 8000.
James -----Original Message----- From: Kev [mailto:KKlopp@EROLS.COM] Sent: Friday, January 14, 2000 3:20 PM To: TechToolsList@flippers.com Subject: Re: Signature Analyzers
For some dumb reason I have several of them, I have the HP 5004 and 5006, a bug trap sig analyzer and a Kurz Kasch model. All are basically about the same, at least as much as I use them. Honestly, I find I seldom use signature analysis. About the only time it really comes in handy is working on vector mathboxes. But it's nice to have it for well documented projects, like the cinematronics boards.
James
Gosh I thought I was the only "dummy" with 3 sig analyzers in the house.
I've got the Bugtrap (My personal favorite) Kurz Kash and the Cat Box.
If anyone is interested in the KK box I'll sell it or trade it. I've also go the KK eprom copier & several modules if anyone has any need for that (read vintage equipment).
My use of a SA?
Well I was fighting enough with Bally pinball boards MPU 17 & 35 that I went thru & did some SA.
I started to do Pac-Man but the buffering circuits complicates SA implimentation. I have used the SA on Pac-Man to catch funky 74ls161's in the timing section. This is a rare case where a using an O-scope the way I do (probe, see if the signal is full range & looks "normal") would not have found the faulty 74ls161, since the outputs were toggling & appeared to work, they just were not correct.
I have unsuccefully SA a Battlezone Math box before.
The SA is an okay tool, it will be more powerful the more people document & share Signatures. I'd take an O-scope of a SA any day but the SA is cheaper and depending on your focus not a bad tool.
Kev mowerman@erols.com http://www.erols.com/mowerman
John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 Call (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) http://www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
-- mailto:jamesm@erinet.com My Homepage! http://www.erinet.com/jamesm -- For the 'bots :-) mailto:root@localhost mailto:abuse@localhost mailto:postmaster@localhost "jamesm.vcf" (missing attachment)
participants (5)
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James Marous -
James Marous -
John Robertson -
Kev -
Noel Johnson